tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18853193.post6768457174757247684..comments2024-01-26T00:56:19.791-05:00Comments on The Lair of the Catholic Cavemen: Unknownnoreply@blogger.comBlogger10125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18853193.post-86666316885443606742009-08-31T10:56:41.572-05:002009-08-31T10:56:41.572-05:00Was it not Bl John XXIII who removed the word '...<i>Was it not Bl John XXIII who removed the word 'perfidious" from the MR?</i><br /><br />I stand corrected. I should have checked my sources first.<br /><br />Re: the V-2 web site. I didn't check the alleged links to the Council documents. I think I will go back and look again.<br /><br />I also agree with the statements criticizing the lack of "Fr." before a priest's name. But I too am not without sin in this regard. E.g., On another web site, I regularly refer to Cardinal Mahony as the "Red Guru." Then again, they say truth is an absolutely defense under the law! LOL I have a couple of other "handles" available for other clerics with whom I take issue.Adeodatus49https://www.blogger.com/profile/16574448503953046867noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18853193.post-7499006246198508402009-08-30T23:56:20.483-05:002009-08-30T23:56:20.483-05:00Cavey - nonobjective is an understatement. The age...Cavey - nonobjective is an understatement. The agenda was clear to me,do as much damage as possible by misrepresentation & innacuracies. This is clearly an attempt to undermine any attempts to provide greater access to the TLM.<br /><br />Adeo49 - Great refutation of all that was wrong with Greene's article. As for that so-called Vatican II website, the only thing that surprized me was that they had links to the actual documents. Most of these "Spirit of Vatican II" types don't want to get anywhere near the actual documents as the documents undermine rather than their claims. Of course, they could have the links up for appearances sake only.<br /><br />Simplex - I am on the same page as you with how I felt about this article. Are they that hard up for sspace that a simple "Fr." before his name was too much?Alhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07721319432213055605noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18853193.post-87417328537158711072009-08-30T23:31:12.392-05:002009-08-30T23:31:12.392-05:00Was it not Bl John XXIII who removed the word '...Was it not Bl John XXIII who removed the word 'perfidious" from the MR?<br /><br />And the holy father has re-written the prayer entirely, and, IMHO with perfect orthodoxy.Davidhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10823532459943232657noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18853193.post-58046808513691581532009-08-30T20:41:39.957-05:002009-08-30T20:41:39.957-05:00I don't know if my previous post (reply) to Fo...I don't know if my previous post (reply) to Former Altar Boy took. It is too long to repeat, but I may not have answered his question directly.<br /><br />No, I don't think "faithless Jews" is appropriate for the reasons I stated in my post previous to yours. Yes, I recognize this is only my opinion, and that others are not bound by it. Nonetheless, and like or or not, recent hierarchical decisions have decided to modify the prayer as Pope Paul VI did. Those Apostolic decisions are authoritative, even if some of us do not think they were appropriate. <br /><br />There are many things re: the fall-out from V-2 that I dislike or even disagree with. But aside from heretical actions, we Catholics are bound in obedience to them in one way or the other as particular circumstances warrant.<br /><br />Our bishops do not have the right to be wrong, but apparently they have the authority to be wrong, and at times, to screw up royally. I can think of Assisi I as a prominent example of a major screw-up, even if the intentions were honorable.Adeodatus49https://www.blogger.com/profile/16574448503953046867noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18853193.post-43607019593087277012009-08-30T18:07:11.881-05:002009-08-30T18:07:11.881-05:00Perhaps just praying for the Jews, the Chosen Peop...Perhaps just praying for the Jews, the Chosen People of God, that they may someday recognize that Jesus Christ is the Messiah of the Jews and of the whole World.<br /><br />. . . or words to that effect.<br /><br />We can say the same thing in different ways without giving overt offense, yet without the wimping out that so often occurs in evangelization and ecumenical activities.<br /><br />I think we must also remember that WWII and the holocaust of 12+ million people, 6 million of whom were Jews has changed things. The prayers of the Good Friday liturgy long pre-date the 20th Century. We can understand the specifics of those prayers in the context of the times in which they were written or perhaps realize that there are folks in later ages (such as today) who will never understand them in that context. Thus, we adjust without compromising the Faith.<br /><br />Yes, I recognize that the post-VII Church has been compromised in many ways. I have read of liberal Jewish leaders (who are not really Jews IMHO) who insist the CC formally recognize that the Jews have their own separate and parallel path to righteousness and salvation. This is rank heresy for the CC to sign on to. It is a form of religious indifferentism, one of the principal results of an inadequate and failed ecumenical program run by RC liberals in the post-VII CC.Adeodatus49https://www.blogger.com/profile/16574448503953046867noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18853193.post-37375117966476957242009-08-30T13:16:29.664-05:002009-08-30T13:16:29.664-05:00Thanks for the advertising, Cavey. Hope it helps....Thanks for the advertising, Cavey. Hope it helps. I just took some of that awful pink stuff to settle my stomach and now I am about to leave for the party! <br /><br />The groom's father is a very close friend of mine from the Navy. We served on the same fast attack nuclear powered submarine so many years ago. Of course you know that there will be some brewski there. I'll need it to survive V-II!! LOL<br /><br />Jim and I (the two Jims) will be toasting the bride and groom. Then like the good bubble heads we are, we will toast the submarine service, the Navy, and of course our shipmates in the USMC. And I will be sure to toast the Cave!<br /><br />Semper Fi!<br /><br />Jim C.<br />. . . whose daughter will be his designated driver.Adeodatus49https://www.blogger.com/profile/16574448503953046867noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18853193.post-10121705675324777692009-08-30T12:46:09.006-05:002009-08-30T12:46:09.006-05:00Cavey,
I just looked over the Vaticum Secundum we...Cavey,<br /><br />I just looked over the Vaticum Secundum web site in your link and read some of the eggregious material therein. Big mistake on my part! It nauseated me and I am supposed to leave in a few minutes for a wedding reception! There goes my pigging out. The reception is in the form of a Luau. I guess even in the Cave one must be very, very careful with what one reads! LOLAdeodatus49https://www.blogger.com/profile/16574448503953046867noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18853193.post-69850794018320468412009-08-30T12:35:21.874-05:002009-08-30T12:35:21.874-05:00No need to apologize. If anything -- a thousand th...No need to apologize. If anything -- a thousand thanks.Kevin Whitemanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07019976622801954677noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18853193.post-18816569153434113502009-08-30T12:26:46.713-05:002009-08-30T12:26:46.713-05:00Greene doesn't know what she's talking abo...Greene doesn't know what she's talking about. Why am I not surprised? She is probably somebody's mouthpiece.<br /><br />The Tridentine Mass is not 1,500 years old. In the 16th Century, Pope St. Pius V decided to standardize the normative liturgy of the Church which had experienced multifarious uses over time, and in some cases became subject to liturgical abuse. <br /><br />What came down as the Mass of Pope St. Pius V, known colloquially (and sometimes erroneously) as the Tridentine Latin Mass, was the very ascetic and "nobly" simple Mass of the Roman Curia which, by tradition, goes back to Pope St. Peter. St. Pius embellished it with elements from the Gallican liturgies. One example of embellishment is the Gloria which in the Byzantine East is recited during Great Compline, the night prayer during for eves of major feasts and Sunday celebrations.<br /><br />Another thing she messed up on. Greene stated that the modern mass, i.e., the Ordinary Form, is the the form that is said in the vernacular. The official version of the N.O.M is LATIN, not any of the vernaculars of the world today. It can be said in Latin which would have the advantage of by-passing the inadequate English translation of the old ICEL. So the "Latin Mass" could very well be the Mass of Pope Paul VI as amended since 1970 or the Mass of Pope St. Pius V, as amended down through the Roman Missal of 1962. Greene should have been specific and careful when talking about the Catholic mass.<br /><br />Folks, this is Catholicism 101. Even a mouthpiece ought to get this right, unless of course there is another agenda going on.<br /><br />Another GROSS error which borders on slander is the prayers for the conversion of Jews. It is not found in the mass, but in the traditional Good Friday liturgy which is a pre-sanctified liturgy (ask the Orthodox about this liturgy--it is attributed traditionally to Pope St. Gregory the Great whom the East calls the Dialogos.). <br /><br />I agree with Pope Paul VI in modifying this prayer so as not to give undue offense to the Jews. The term "perfidious" merely means faithless (strictly vis-a-vis Jesus Christ the Lord), but does not mean that Jews do not believe in God. Also, "perfidious" has an awful sound to it (IMHO) just as the terms: rapist, child molester, etc. So if we are to use these terms, we must really mean them and they must be true.<br /><br />That said, we must still pray for the Jews because Jesus Himself said "Unless you are born of water and the Spirit, you shall not enter the Kingdom of God." Water Baptism is the ordinarily necessary means of salvation. This has been Divinely revealed to the Church by Jesus Christ through sacred scripture, and it therefore a Dogma of the Faith.<br /><br />The Latin Mass according to the Roman Missal of 1962 ought to be said in every parish Church, not just in special Churches. It is up to the laity to make this happen. According to Summorum Pontificum, all that is needed is a "stable" group of laity to make the request. The bishop has to comply.<br /><br />Ooops! Another long post. This one struck a sensitive nerve in me. LOLAdeodatus49https://www.blogger.com/profile/16574448503953046867noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18853193.post-20424508194651462422009-08-30T09:32:06.345-05:002009-08-30T09:32:06.345-05:00This woman's article pissed me off to no end. ...This woman's article pissed me off to no end. She continuously referred to my Priest as "Parkerson". Such purposful disrespect. I sent this email to her:<br /><br />Ms. Greene,<br /><br />Apparently you do not seem to understand the full breadth of respect that a Priest should garner. Your constant referral to Father Paul Parkerson as just Parkerson is disgraceful and disrespectful. <br /><br />Maybe you should take some time to read up on the subject matter to which you write. Of course that would mean more work than you want to do, as a Diva.Simplex Virhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10794134630791552159noreply@blogger.com